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    #81
    Originally posted by Helly View Post
    So, counter-productive to the US? America was a mistake anyway tbh.
    It's in everyone's best interest if no one is feuding over who has the biggest nationcock.



    That's exactly what it is. Whites wake up one day and find more and more black people showing up on their block, or blacks wake up and find more and more hispanics coming to their neighborhood, they're gonna move to wherever their people are.

    Gonna need to see which studies these are. I think I know which one you're talking about, but you should link it.
    That's not how it was, whites intentionally denied loans and prevented blacks from being able to even afford living in their neighborhoods. Nobody but the most fervent of racist move because "Oh no, my neighbors are getting browner!". I



    Amd they're socially isolated because diversity becomes a detriment to trust and cohesion after a certain point.
    It does if senators are lying about welfare queens in cadillacs.



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      #82
      Originally posted by #83.6666666667 View Post

      So should Steven Hawkins, instead of pursuing his dreams, just said fuck it and stay a semi vegetable? Should minorities just not try and better themselves because they were born in a poor family? Or am I being unfair and misrepresenting you?
      All I'm doing is taking the same logic used against racial pride and turning it against the alternative(pride in the individual), to simply make the point that both are equally vacuous and only as detrimental as a person allows them to be. It makes no sense to say "It's silly to be proud of circumstances that you had no real power over" and then provide the alternative of "you should instead be proud of this other set of circumstances that you also had no real power over". In order to validate it, you would first need to go against what is basically a universally accepted truth at this point and prove the existence of free will. Even then, you'd only barely scratch the surface

      Comment


        #83
        Originally posted by Helly View Post

        Don't misunderstand - I'm not saying we should treat people as automatons, not at all. I'm well aware of the consequences. I'm simply pointing out the flaw in the reasoning of "being proud that you were born into a set of circumstances is silly and dumb". Ultimately, everyone simply is a victim of circumstance, and so the refutation of being proud of a series of events that your brain reacted to makes no sense.
        Everyone will be a victim of SOME sort of circumstance of one form or another, and everyone reacts to everything and anything in one way or another, whether it's choosing to take action or choosing to do absolutely nothing, I really don't see how this is a contention and the root of your "free will isn't a thing" view. HOW you react...that's where the choice comes in.

        I mean...

        You can't look at someone after years of college to attain a hard degree finally landing that high-end job and say "that's not really your achievement, that's just circumstance, don't be proud of that hard work, that has no more merit to it than that person over there who is proud of the color they were born with."

        They moved their own two hands to get that result to be proud of what they did, the racist didn't have to do jack shit. Maybe move his eyeballs towards the mirror, I guess, if I'm being truly fair.

        But their feelings have basically equal merit?

        I mean, by this logic...

        I have no reason to have any particular respect for my Dad as the type of person he is. In fact, by your logic, I should have as much respect for my Dad as I do the KKK member burning the cross and whining about black people while working only a dead end job because they picked up racist bitching over actual hard work.

        The entire reason he went to the Navy and kicked ass, does well at his job at Boeing, became well-versed in martial arts to the point he can actually teach it well enough, got to the middle class after dealing with being born in poverty and later kicking a drug addiction to the curb to become a family man of 4 kids barraging him with endless fuck ups on their part only to come out a happy and content pastor of a church without harboring a burning hatred for the world is only because of circumstance...he just reacted to things in the way his particular brain does, nothing any more special or admirable in terms of personal qualities than that kid who flunked school and joined the Neo-Nazi gang across the street, because free will isn't really a thing.

        Because we're all victims of circumstances.

        Because of some obvious truism.

        No.

        Fuck that.

        That's basically the same fucking bullshit behind the "all cultures are equal" nonsense, and I know for a fact that you don't believe that, because you think the Mexicans coming up South are polluting America, lol.
        Last edited by RussianCoffeeAddict; March 11th, 2019, 12:12 AM.

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          #84
          Originally posted by #83.6666666667 View Post

          No.one.ever.said.humans.can't.make.distinctions.
          I'm just going to ignore the rest of your post, because it's obvious you got owned (again) by Helly the god and are just gonna act like a complete retard who doesn't understand English.

          If that's true, then why did you try to claim that identifying with a skin colour was a Western phenomenon?

          Comment


            #85
            Originally posted by Helly View Post

            All I'm doing is taking the same logic used against racial pride and turning it against the alternative(pride in the individual), to simply make the point that both are equally vacuous and only as detrimental as a person allows them to be. It makes no sense to say "It's silly to be proud of circumstances that you had no real power over" and then provide the alternative of "you should instead be proud of this other set of circumstances that you also had no real power over". In order to validate it, you would first need to go against what is basically a universally accepted truth at this point and prove the existence of free will. Even then, you'd only barely scratch the surface
            Are you on drugs? These things are nothing alike. One is based on what color of skin both your parents are the other how you develop based on personal decisions and your environment. Regardless, you can overcome the other factors with your decisions.

            Neither the existence of free will or the lack of it are universally accepted, stop.

            Comment


              #86
              Originally posted by Tezcatlipoca View Post
              It's in everyone's best interest if no one is feuding over who has the biggest nationcock.



              That's not how it was, whites intentionally denied loans and prevented blacks from being able to even afford living in their neighborhoods. Nobody but the most fervent of racist move because "Oh no, my neighbors are getting browner!". I



              It does if senators are lying about welfare queens in cadillacs.


              Sure, but that's assuming we allow that pride to become excessive.

              "The most fervent"? That's quite the assumption.

              This is....just another crazy assumption. I can't debate about feels, dude. lol


              Originally posted by RussianCoffeeAddict View Post

              Everyone will be a victim of SOME sort of circumstance of one form or another, and everyone reacts to everything and anything in one way or another, whether it's choosing to take action or choosing to do absolutely nothing, I really don't see how this is a contention and the root of your "free will isn't a thing" view. HOW you react...that's where the choice comes in.

              I mean...

              You can't look at someone after years of college to attain a hard degree finally landing that high-end job and say "that's not really your achievement, that's just circumstance, don't be proud of that hard work, that has no more merit to it than that person over there who is proud of the color they were born with."

              They moved their own two hands to get that result to be proud of what they did, the racist didn't have to do jack shit. Maybe move his eyeballs towards the mirror, I guess, if I'm being truly fair.

              But their feelings have basically equal merit?

              I mean, by this logic...

              I have no reason to have any particular respect for my Dad as the type of person he is. In fact, by your logic, I should have as much respect for the KKK member burning the cross and whining about black people while working only a dead end job because they picked up racist bitching over actual hard work as I do for my Dad.

              The entire reason he went to the Navy and kicked ass, does well at his job at Boeing, became well-versed in martial arts to the point he can actually teach it well enough, got to the middle class after dealing with being born in poverty and later kicking a drug addiction to the curb to become a family man of 4 kids barraging him with endless fuck ups on their part only to come out a happy and content pastor of a church without harboring a burning hatred for the world is only because of circumstance...he just reacted to things in the way his particular brain does, nothing any more special or admirable in terms of personal qualities than that kid who flunked school and joined the Neo-Nazi gang planning to shoot up the neighborhood synagogue across the street, because free will isn't really a thing.

              Because we're all victims of circumstances.

              Because of some truism.

              No.

              Fuck that.

              That's the same fucking bullshit behind the "all cultures are equal" nonsense, and I know for a fact that you don't believe that, because you think the Mexicans coming up South are polluting America, lol.
              RCA, I'm trying to explain to you that I dont believe in practicing a deterministic system, lol. Read my response to the local brain trust, I think I elaborated a bit better there.

              Comment


                #87
                Originally posted by Helly View Post

                I'm just going to ignore the rest of your post, because it's obvious you got owned (again) by Helly the god and are just gonna act like a complete retard who doesn't understand English.

                If that's true, then why did you try to claim that identifying with a skin colour was a Western phenomenon?
                Because you can't find a Egyptian saying brown pride. I actually gave an entire explanation as to what I meant. I guess you're just a "disgusting reprobate " to cherry pick my posts.

                Why are you so retarded?

                Comment


                  #88
                  Originally posted by #83.6666666667 View Post

                  Are you on drugs? These things are nothing alike. One is based on what color of skin both your parents are the other how you develop based on personal decisions and your environment. Regardless, you can overcome the other factors with your decisions.

                  Neither the existence of free will or the lack of it are universally accepted, stop.
                  *Personal decisions that were affected by the environment, including the environment of the biological mechanism called your brain.

                  No honest philosopher would honestly try to contend against determinism without making some very strange appeals.

                  Comment


                    #89
                    Originally posted by Helly View Post

                    *Personal decisions that were affected by the environment, including the environment of the biological mechanism called your brain.

                    No honest philosopher would honestly try to contend against determinism without making some very strange appeals.
                    Which can be develop into what you make it. Sure it has limitations but those are the same as every human. Again, we're not so different. There's not a person on Earth with a healthy mind that can't read, talk, etc.

                    For example, you bring a child from the Amazon to America, you can teach him to be just like everyone else. Read the same things know the same things.

                    How silly would that " philosopher "need to be to waste their time arguing a point they're programmed to argue?
                    Last edited by #83.6666666667; March 11th, 2019, 12:33 AM.

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                      #90
                      Originally posted by #83.6666666667 View Post
                      Because you can't find a Egyptian saying brown pride.
                      "As discussed in Chapter 3, Egyptian art depicted Egyptians on the one hand and Nubians and other blacks on the other hand with distinctively differ-ent ethnic characteristics and depicted this abundantly and often aggressively. The Egyptians accurately, arrogantly and aggressively made national and ethnic distinctions from a very early date in their art and literature."


                      "As we have seen in Chapter 3, there is an extraordinary abundance of Egyp-tian works of art which clearly depicted sharply contrasted reddish-brown Egyptians and black Nubians, especially in battle and prisoner scenes, and hun-dreds of scenes depicting several separate ethnic groups, including Nubians and Bantus."




                      Never post again.

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                        #91
                        Originally posted by Helly View Post



                        RCA, I'm trying to explain to you that I dont believe in practicing a deterministic system, lol. Read my response to the local brain trust, I think I elaborated a bit better there.
                        Not practicing a deterministic system doesn't have anything to do with what you said, fren...nor with what I said.

                        Let's go back to the source.

                        All things considered, being proud of natural talent can be considered as vacuous as being proud of the ethnic group you were born into.
                        You're arguing that being proud of your own merit (which was what Louay mentioned) could be considered no better than racial pride. You even explicitly asked "Is merit a valid thing to be proud of?" It's the source of the quote that I bolded in my last post, I believe.

                        So I'm pretty sure I'm not misreading you here.

                        And if they're really no more justified than each other, why shouldn't I view the two sentiments as basically on equal footing, with equal justification? And if they're equally justified, then that means that the source of the pride is basically...on equal footing. Otherwise, if the sources of the sentiments are not on equal footing...why bother treating the pride around both sources equally? Lol.

                        Which leads to the problem I told you about.

                        Viewing the college kid who graduated with that hard ass degree and that mountain of debt, proud of getting that job, as basically having as much justification to be proud of his achievements as the racist has to be proud of being born with whatever skin color. Which basically puts the two actions on equal footing, because they both deserve the same reaction (in this case, pride).

                        And as you can see...

                        That bothers me.
                        Last edited by RussianCoffeeAddict; March 11th, 2019, 12:43 AM.

                        Comment


                          #92
                          Originally posted by #83.6666666667 View Post

                          Which can be develop into what you make it. Sure it has limitations but those are the same as every human. Again, we're not so different. There's not a person on Earth with a healthy mind that can't read, talk, etc.

                          For example, you bring a child from the Amazon to America, you can teach him to be just like everyone else. Read the same things know the same things.

                          How silly would that " philosopher "need to be to waste their time arguing a point they're programmed to argue?
                          It can only be developed into whatever preset course has been layed out before you, and only if you are predisposed to embark on such a course in the first place.

                          This will get way off topic and esoteric, so if you're genuinely interested in a discussion, you should probably make a new thread.

                          Comment


                            #93
                            Originally posted by Helly View Post

                            "As discussed in Chapter 3, Egyptian art depicted Egyptians on the one hand and Nubians and other blacks on the other hand with distinctively differ-ent ethnic characteristics and depicted this abundantly and often aggressively. The Egyptians accurately, arrogantly and aggressively made national and ethnic distinctions from a very early date in their art and literature."


                            "As we have seen in Chapter 3, there is an extraordinary abundance of Egyp-tian works of art which clearly depicted sharply contrasted reddish-brown Egyptians and black Nubians, especially in battle and prisoner scenes, and hun-dreds of scenes depicting several separate ethnic groups, including Nubians and Bantus."




                            Never post again.
                            You didn't even cite the source or give reference to the page.
                            Not only that but those quotes don't prove racial anything. Please learn definitions.

                            Comment


                            • Helly
                              Helly commented
                              Editing a comment
                              lmao

                            #94
                            Originally posted by RussianCoffeeAddict View Post

                            Not practicing a deterministic system doesn't have anything to do with what you said, fren...nor with what I said.

                            Let's go back to the source.



                            You're arguing that being proud of your own merit (which was what Louay mentioned) could be considered no better than racial pride. You even explicitly asked "Is merit a valid thing to be proud of?" It's the source of the quote that I bolded in my last post, I believe.

                            So I'm pretty sure I'm not misreading you here.

                            And if they're really no more justified than each other, why shouldn't I view the two sentiments as basically on equal footing, with equal justification? And if they're equally justified, then that means that the source of the pride is basically...on equal footing. Otherwise, if the sources of the sentiments are not on equal footing...why bother treating the pride of both sources equally? Lol.

                            Which leads to the problem I told you about.

                            Viewing the college kid who graduated with that hard ass degree and that mountain of debt, proud of getting that job, as basically having as much justification to be proud of his achievements as the racist has to be proud of being born with whatever skin color. Which basically puts the two actions on equal footing.

                            And as you can see...

                            That bothers me.
                            I'm sorry that it bothers you, but that is the inevitable conclusion of your line of reasoning....unless you either try to define and then prove free will, or simply draw an arbitrary line between how large or small a gap needs to be before you're comfortable with someone taking pride in a process indifferent to them.

                            Then again, language itself is pretty arbitrary, but I don't feel like opening that headache-inducing can of anti-realism right now.....

                            Comment


                              #95
                              Originally posted by Helly View Post

                              It can only be developed into whatever preset course has been layed out before you, and only if you are predisposed to embark on such a course in the first place.

                              This will get way off topic and esoteric, so if you're genuinely interested in a discussion, you should probably make a new thread.
                              Why did Stephen Hawkins come to be known for has a brilliant person if he was destined to be paralyzed?


                              If fate will it.

                              Comment


                                #96
                                Originally posted by Helly View Post

                                I'm sorry that it bothers you, but that is the inevitable conclusion of your line of reasoning....unless you either try to define and then prove free will, or simply draw an arbitrary line between how large or small a gap needs to be before you're comfortable with someone taking pride in a process indifferent to them.

                                Then again, language itself is pretty arbitrary, but I don't feel like opening that headache-inducing can of anti-realism right now.....
                                Next you'll be telling us that we can't prove we exist so it doesn't matter that you took a beating in this thread, lmao.

                                Comment


                                  #97
                                  Originally posted by Helly View Post

                                  I'm sorry that it bothers you, but that is the inevitable conclusion of your line of reasoning...
                                  No, it's not.

                                  The college kid who got out into the job market with a mountain of debt took on a personal challenge, and through his effort...built his life with his own two hands.

                                  The racist didn't build jack shit. He just exists and gets a burst of feeling some self-respect automatically, apparently. He didn't sacrifice any of his time to actually do anything. He didn't have to go through any of the stresses of building up his life, going through any random curveballs that life could throw at him.

                                  He didn't do any of that. But because of something that two different people GAVE to him, possibly even without a care in the world about what skin color the guy would have anyway, his pride has the same exact value as the guy who actually BUILT the source of his pride, with his own sweat and tears.

                                  Both are equally worthy of self-admiration...equally worthy of admiration in general, because of that.

                                  They are not on equal footing.

                                  They are simply not.

                                  To follow such thinking devalues merit as a concept in and of itself.

                                  And that's some odd thinking for someone as outwardly, blatantly egotistic as you towards your own achievements...
                                  Last edited by RussianCoffeeAddict; March 11th, 2019, 01:07 AM.

                                  Comment


                                    #98
                                    Originally posted by RussianCoffeeAddict View Post

                                    No, it's not.

                                    The college kid who got out into the job market with a mountain of debt took on a personal challenge, and through his effort...built his life with his own two hands.

                                    The racist didn't build jack shit. He just exists and gets a burst of feeling some self-respect automatically, apparently. He didn't sacrifice any of his time to actually do anything. He didn't have to go through any of the stresses of building up his life, going through any random curveballs that life could throw at him.

                                    He didn't do any of that. But because of something that two different people GAVE to him, possibly even without a care in the world about what skin color the guy would have anyway, his pride has the same exact value as the guy who actually BUILT the source of his pride, with his own sweat and tears.

                                    But both are equally worthy of self-admiration...equally worthy of admiration in general, because of that.

                                    They are not on equal footing.

                                    They are simply not.

                                    To follow such thinking devalues merit as a concept in and of itself.

                                    And that's some odd thinking for someone as outwardly, blatantly egotistic as you towards your own achievements...
                                    He's being dumbass. He's basically in his own little world right now. Most likely he learned a few new philosophical concepts listening to Jordan Peterson and now is up his own ass. Don't even try reasoning with him right now because he's not in "reality", he's basically a crack-head right now.

                                    I blame the people of this site for encouraging his behavior.

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                                      #99
                                      You know, I think Orgy had more of a point about the topic being riddled with images of twerking senators than I gave him cred for...

                                      I'd say it's gotten what I wanted (the reactions), but the contrast between the twerking ass and this whole convo...

                                      Yeah, I'm gonna switch the thing out, lol.

                                      (It was fun while it lasted thooooooo).
                                      Last edited by RussianCoffeeAddict; March 11th, 2019, 02:08 AM.

                                      Comment


                                        Originally posted by RussianCoffeeAddict View Post

                                        Ah, so people do notice it.

                                        Beautiful set, isn't it?
                                        Don't know if you changed the set when you made this post, but it's still kinda hideous (though a far sight better than before, at least). I suppose I shouldn't be too surprised, however, given that your opinions are equally hideous. Imagine being an unapologetic human supremacist when it's been proven time and time again that humans are essentially the ass cancer of organic life.
                                        Last edited by Oneiros; March 11th, 2019, 02:24 AM.

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