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T5 Official Discussion: The Trump Presidency

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  • Louay
    replied
    Interesting how American officials are just now admitting that the YPG is no more than an offshoot of the PKK

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  • Lord L'Zoril
    replied
    Originally posted by Raniero View Post
    I'm not one for conspiracy theories, but after learning a bit more about the corrupt shitshow that's our government over the last few years, I can believe it
    They say prostitution is the world's oldest hustle. I would profess warmongering is older still.

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  • Raniero
    replied
    Originally posted by Lord L'Zoril View Post
    Of course, if Moore is to be believed, it was an "inside job." The bin Laden family has connections to the House of Saud, who in turn are affiliated with virtually every noteworthy dynasty in D.C., which notably includes the Bushes.
    I'm not one for conspiracy theories, but after learning a bit more about the corrupt shitshow that's our government over the last few years, I can believe it

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  • Lord L'Zoril
    replied
    Originally posted by Raniero View Post

    No. Look up Hart-Rudman Task Force. The US Government and Intelligence agencies were actually aware a major terrorist attack could occur, but intelligence failures and lack of action is why 9/11 happened when it could have been preemptively stopped. The Task Force recommended back in February 2001 that the US needed to create a new national homeland security agency to improve and direct all the agencies and departments that were involved in homeland security missions. But the Office of Homeland Security wasn't created until after 9/11 happened.

    It's simple, the US fucked up.
    Ah. In that case, I agree. If they had actionable intel about a potential attack taking place on American soil, they should've proactively attempted to prevent it from even occuring by tightening up security domestically (red tape, even on its own, usually ensures that bureaucracy is total bullshit) instead of reactively starting a completely avoidable "war" the world over.

    Of course, if Moore is to be believed, it was an "inside job." The bin Laden family has connections to the House of Saud, who in turn are affiliated with virtually every noteworthy dynasty in D.C., which notably includes the Bushes.
    Last edited by Lord L'Zoril; October 13th, 2019, 02:15 AM.

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  • OrganizationXV
    replied
    Originally posted by Ladd View Post
    Saying Trump fucked up implies what he did was an accident.
    I think he definitely cut some deal with Turkey.

    If he was serious about pulling out of Syria he would've totally pulled out and not just pulled out troops away from the Kurds. At least then he could've gotten away with just an "oopsie".
    Trump's fuckup is cutting the deal with Turkey, I would argue. If someone chooses to make a bad move, that's as much on them as if they just messed up a good plan.

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  • Ladd
    replied
    Saying Trump fucked up implies what he did was an accident.
    I think he definitely cut some deal with Turkey.

    If he was serious about pulling out of Syria he would've totally pulled out and not just pulled out troops away from the Kurds. At least then he could've gotten away with just an "oopsie".

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  • Raniero
    commented on 's reply
    In regards to Syria, he 100% fucked up in not being involved enough, because he just screwed our allies there and allowed a war to start.

  • Raniero
    replied
    Originally posted by RussianCoffeeAddict View Post
    So should we go be the world police willy nilly or make sure our intel gets its shit together (if it hasn't already)? I personally like the latter. Let's take a look at the former to see why...

    Nothing. Pretty much nothing came from being the big Po Po of the M.E if not actually making things worse. If a terrorist organization "died," its baby just grew up instead.

    What DID we get, though, in return? Tens of thousands of American dead, more dead on the other side, and lots of civvies dead too, on top of a nice fresh wave of traumatized veterans to come home to a country that can't get them either a job or the necessary help.

    Probably a lot of other side effects.

    And it cost a ton of money too.

    At some point, you gotta realize you either can't remedy the situation militarily because the situation isn't in your favor...or you suck at your job. Either way, I don't like the idea of continuing, at best I see things merely being put on loop for another decade or two.
    I never once said we should act like police. My point is that there already existed comprehensive strategy to prevent terrorist attacks like 9/11, before it even happened. Intelligence agencies didn't cooperate or share intelligence on credible threats according to the 9/11 Commission Report. We didn't pay attention to who came to our country. There was an assessment document that existed that told the US government that a mass casualty event was imminent, but no steps were taken. The Patriot Act wasn't created in just a few months--it had basically already existed before 9/11.


    There were ways to prevent 9/11 without warfare. So yes, I basically meant our intel agencies and government should have gotten their shit together, which it did after the fact. Though our current president seems to be on a mission to fuck out intelligence agencies up the ass.
    Last edited by Raniero; October 12th, 2019, 03:52 PM.

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  • Raniero
    replied
    Originally posted by Lord L'Zoril View Post

    Don't really disagree with the overall sentiment, but what did you mean by this? Are you insinuating that we should be preemptively be bombing the shit out of people who live in literal straw huts to "counteract terrorism"? Because that's how more terrorists are made. When you blow up the families and friends of people who were once innocent civilians in drone strikes and call it "collateral damage."

    That surely ain't it, G.
    No. Look up Hart-Rudman Task Force. The US Government and Intelligence agencies were actually aware a major terrorist attack could occur, but intelligence failures and lack of action is why 9/11 happened when it could have been preemptively stopped. The Task Force recommended back in February 2001 that the US needed to create a new national homeland security agency to improve and direct all the agencies and departments that were involved in homeland security missions. But the Office of Homeland Security wasn't created until after 9/11 happened.

    It's simple, the US fucked up.
    Last edited by Raniero; October 12th, 2019, 03:54 PM.

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  • Cid
    replied
    Originally posted by RussianCoffeeAddict View Post

    Except that whereas you guys believe he fucked up for not being involved enough in M.E. affairs, I believe he fucked up for being involved too much.

    There’s a difference.
    I haven't really posted any opinion on the matter, actually. I stated pretty clearly that I hadn't kept up with the whole Syria thing.

    My meme was more in line with notion that Trump always fucks up pretty much everything he gets involved in.

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  • RussianCoffeeAddict
    replied
    Originally posted by Cid View Post

    Except that whereas you guys believe he fucked up for not being involved enough in M.E. affairs, I believe he fucked up for being involved too much.

    There’s a difference.
    Last edited by RussianCoffeeAddict; October 12th, 2019, 02:18 PM.

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  • Cid
    replied
    Originally posted by RussianCoffeeAddict View Post
    Trump fucked up

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  • RussianCoffeeAddict
    replied
    Originally posted by J peth View Post

    It's about money not about ending pax americana.
    So Trump can't be bothered to do it, not without finding another place to mess with? And as Ladd as said, he couldn’t even bother to do the pull out correctly? For the moneys?
    ​​​
    Alright, shift of position.

    Trump fucked up and is a perfect example of why our military involvement in the M.E. need to end pronto.
    Last edited by RussianCoffeeAddict; October 12th, 2019, 01:55 PM.

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  • J peth
    replied
    Originally posted by RussianCoffeeAddict View Post
    So did Trump actually withdraw or just “withdraw,” as in, still keep a bunch of soldiers in even if the number’s smaller...?

    Because if it’s the first...

    Good on him.

    This is a good step to ending the endless wars that don’t amount to anything good in the end.

    I doubt it’s for good reasons...but it’s a good result.
    and yet he deployed more troops elsewhere.

    It's about money not about ending pax americana.

    Leave a comment:


  • Ladd
    replied
    Originally posted by Flame Saber View Post
    Can someone explain why America is sending troops to Saudi again? I mean, just now you guys pulled out of Syria and Trump didn't want anything to do with M.E.
    My friend let me show you something.



    https://prnt.sc/pi9qra

    https://prnt.sc/pi9r3o

    https://prnt.sc/pi9rcs
    Last edited by Ladd; October 12th, 2019, 04:34 AM.

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  • Ladd
    replied
    Originally posted by RussianCoffeeAddict View Post
    So did Trump actually withdraw or just “withdraw,” as in, still keep a bunch of soldiers in even if the number’s smaller...?

    Because if it’s the first...

    Good on him.

    This is a good step to ending the endless wars that don’t amount to anything good in the end.

    I doubt it’s for good reasons...but it’s a good result.
    I'm not completely up to date on the story but last I heard Trump only specifically pulled out troops from where the Kurds are. And kept the troops everywhere else.
    Now Trump is doing this blatantly fake anti war rhetoric to deflect from the fact that he sold out our allies, probably for a quick buck in some shady back room deal.

    Trump is not anti war, he hired a fucking neocon warmonger to be in charge of foreign policy.
    Last edited by Ladd; October 12th, 2019, 04:35 AM.

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  • Lord L'Zoril
    replied
    Originally posted by Raniero View Post
    if America was more proactive
    Don't really disagree with the overall sentiment, but what did you mean by this? Are you insinuating that we should be preemptively be bombing the shit out of people who live in literal straw huts to "counteract terrorism"? Because that's how more terrorists are made. When you blow up the families and friends of people who were once innocent civilians in drone strikes and call it "collateral damage."

    That surely ain't it, G.
    Last edited by Lord L'Zoril; October 12th, 2019, 03:29 AM.

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  • Flame Saber
    replied
    Can someone explain why America is sending troops to Saudi again? I mean, just now you guys pulled out of Syria and Trump didn't want anything to do with M.E.

    Leave a comment:


  • RussianCoffeeAddict
    replied
    Originally posted by Raniero View Post
    9/11 could have been prevented with proper intelligence and if America was more proactive, but your dumbass is asking for a repeat.
    So should we go be the world police willy nilly or make sure our intel gets its shit together (if it hasn't already)? I personally like the latter. Let's take a look at the former to see why...

    Nothing. Pretty much nothing came from being the big Po Po of the M.E if not actually making things worse. If a terrorist organization "died," its baby just grew up instead.

    What DID we get, though, in return? Tens of thousands of American dead, more dead on the other side, and lots of civvies dead too, on top of a nice fresh wave of traumatized veterans to come home to a country that can't get them either a job or the necessary help.

    Probably a lot of other side effects.

    And it cost a ton of money too.

    At some point, you gotta realize you either can't remedy the situation militarily because the situation isn't in your favor...or you suck at your job. Either way, I don't like the idea of continuing, at best I see things merely being put on loop for another decade or two.
    Last edited by RussianCoffeeAddict; October 12th, 2019, 02:40 AM.

    Leave a comment:


  • Raniero
    replied
    Originally posted by RussianCoffeeAddict View Post
    So did Trump actually withdraw or just “withdraw,” as in, still keep a bunch of soldiers in even if the number’s smaller...?

    Because if it’s the first...

    Good on him.
    Yeah, good on him for abandoning US allies, the ones that took the real brunt of the war against ISIS, to die because they didn't help us in Normandy.

    This is a good step to ending the endless wars that don’t amount to anything good in the end.
    You mean the war between Turkey and the Kurds he just caused by withdrawing US troops? A war that'll probably end with the reestablishment of a powerful ISIS force?

    If we get fucked with again like in 9/11, we can go in and kick their asses. Well, if we actually bother to strike at the heart of the problem *cough* ignoring Saudi Arabia *cough,* otherwise the effort's wasted.
    How is it smart homeland security policy to act after an attack happens when it could have been prevented? 9/11 could have been prevented with proper intelligence and if America was more proactive, but your dumbass is asking for a repeat.

    But if not, just let everyone else in the M.E. deal with them. They've had time to take notes on our fuck-ups, at least...
    Because this worked out well before. We should never have went to the middle east, but we're there now and an abrupt retreat from a region that needs American forces is bad strategy and it's shown to do more harm than good. It's why ISIS exists in the first place.
    Last edited by Raniero; October 12th, 2019, 01:53 AM.

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